Traveller-digest     Thursday, December 26 1996     Volume 1996 : Number 792



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Re: Water on Starships
Marines and all that
Psioinic lovers -- this should be a blues song
Re: Interstellar Psionics, Canonical Use Of
Die Gedanken sind frei
Re: Toilets in the Far Future
Re: Laundry in the Far Future
NAVAL ACADEMY and MARINES
Laundry in the Far Future
Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #791
Starports (long)
Re: Water on Starships
Re:Starliner Sourcebook
Re: Tech and Starports
Old AOL Mail
Art & misanthropic geeks
T4 Adventures
Psionic Knights?
Re: Laundry in the Far Future
Re: Starliner Sourcebook?
Re: Art & misanthropic geeks
Re: Starliner Sourcebook?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 15:08:29 -0600 (CST)
From: "Peter  H. Brenton" <pete@cummings.uchicago.edu>
Subject: Re: Water on Starships

On Mon, 23 Dec 1996, Douglas wrote:

> Hmmm...let's see
> 
> Hydrogen for fuel - usually carried in massive quanities (tons I believe
> is the unit of measurement).
> 

In liquid pressurized form, yes.  

> Oxygen for lifesupport - not measured per se, but inferred by the
> biochemistry of most of the charactors.
> 

Oxygen is not actually carried in any significant quantity.  The existing
oxygen/nitrogen atmosphese in the ship is 'scrubbed' of CO2 by the life
support system.  I imagine that a reserve of atmospheric gasses already
mixed (i.e. Nitrogen/oxygen - can't breathe pure O2 after all) is also
kept.  Certainly not a big enough reserve to be making H2O out of. 

> Put 'em together, in appropriate proportions - H2O (water).  Useable for
> cooking, cleaning, drinking AND recycling.  BTW, you also get electricity.
> 

and heat and light, is ther any way to combine Oxygen and Hydrogen to make
water without creating an explosion?  This is a bit of a drawback (though 
not a big one).  

> And, as the ultimate recycler - the fuel purifiers found on most (not
all)
> ships.

Good thought.  The fuel purifier on starships could probably be adapted to
purify the (drinking or other) water supply when not needed to remove
impurities from Hydrogen, or crack water into H2 (H3?).  Problem is you'd
need a storage tank or be without water for 1-2 days (again, not a big
problem).   

Dovetailing with the parrallel thread on 'Glop' I still feel that on a
starship which is supposed to travel only 2-4 weeks between stops the
amount of space devoted to life support/waste recycling can be reduced by
storing most of the waste, recycling the water, and pumping out the waste
at the next stopover (at the same time changing/recharging the other LS
equipment; air scrubbers, water filters, etc).  

Turning human waste (of all types) into edible food (and breathable air) 
requires a fairly extensive, volumnous closed ecosystem.  It can be done,
and is not too difficult, but my guess after researching the subject (in
an admittedly shallow way) for a Glisten campaign (asteroid world) is that
about 4 dtons of space is required for each person on board *just for life
support and waste recycling*.  This amount is multiplied by about 1.2 to
allow for visitors and safety margins, as well as to sell some resource to
passing starships (remember that 1000cr per person fee for LS recharges?).

For a ship to have such a support system would also require additional
personnel to tend to the "Gardens". 

Conclusion;  People seem to have their own systems, which are usable,
believable, and fine, but I think that typical starships will find it more
economical space-wise to reuse only water and air, while storing other
wastes, rather than trying to run their own ecosystem within the ship.
Even the Glop from CSC seems to require a 'tank' of significant size to
reprocess the waste.

Pete 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 16:35:38 -0500
From: 34zbtxq@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu (Susan M. Shock)
Subject: Marines and all that

Thanks to Joe and Steve for your comments on my post about Marines skills. I
should point out that this is, of course, a house rule, but I feel it makes
sense and restores some usefulness to Marines as far as serving on naval
vessels as ship troops. I especially appreciated Steve's comments on what
weapons Marines would likely be assigned to. With no real military knowledge
or experience of my own to draw on, it is helpful to hear from someone who knows
what they're talking about! I hadn't considered that bit about Marines being
assigned to bay weapons; it makes sense and will help me when designing
ships to determine which ships get Marines and which don't.
                                        Allen

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:01:09 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Psioinic lovers -- this should be a blues song

>From: aboulton@cix.compulink.co.uk (Andrew Boulton)

>>On the other hand, with clairvoyance and teleportation, they can easily
>>cheat on you and still know when you're on the way home and get there
>>before you. >>

>But no Zhodani would ever even *think* about cheating on you!

Well, it depends, I suppose.  Although Zhodani are honest to a fault within Zhodani 
society, they might not be when living in the Imperium.  ("When in Rome, act as the 
Romans do.")  For example, in wartime, Zhodani forces make use of surprises and ruses 
just as well as anyone else (maybe better, hence the scenario's title "Perfidious 
Zhodane" in Azhanti High Lightning), and these surely require dishonesty.  If they can 
lie in war, surely they can lie in love.  

With non-Zhodani psionic significant others, you certainly run the described risk.  

- --Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:18:41 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Re: Interstellar Psionics, Canonical Use Of

>From: David Smart <dsmart@flash.net>

>I wasn't privy to the discussion but JTAS #5 has an article on "Special
>Psionic Powers" which includes a power called *Jaunting*. It's described
>as "The ability to teleport interstellar distances under limited

Jaunting is the name of the teleportation power that is central to The Stars My 
Destination.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:10:22 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Die Gedanken sind frei

>From: Mused <marz@hotstar.net>

>Would one of the TML's linguistic experts be able to tell me what the >following phrase
>means: "Die Gedanken Sind Frei"

Literally, "the thoughts are free."  This is the title of beautiful song often sung by 
Allied prisoners in German POW camps (and by high school chums and I). 

Die Gedanken sind frei
Wer kann sie erraten?
Sie fliegen vorbei
Wie naechtliche Schatten.

I don't remember the rest.  (Thoughts are free;/ who can guess them?/ They fly away/ 
light nightly (or night-like) shadows.)  It would be a good song in the Fifth Frontier 
War context, I think, although somewhat more ambiguous.  The Imperial prisoners might 
sing it and mean, you don't have the resources to read every single mind at every 
moment.  The Zhodani prisoners might sing it and mean, you deadheads don't have a clue 
what we're thinking about.

>Sorry, but this is the only place where I actually know German speakers
>Sorry, once again for being non-Traveller, but this is driving me nuts

We can usually find a Traveller hook, hence my response to the list, but your local 
educational institutions often have foreign language departments, whose faculty and 
students are often willing to answer simple questions.  The reference sections of many 
libraries contain foreign language dictionaries, too, although without knowing the 
grammar, you might not find them completely helpful.  

- --Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:49:25 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Re: Toilets in the Far Future

>From: "Joseph E. Walsh" <ransom@connect.iconnect.net>

>The text in CSC _seems_ to indicate that starship toilets route the
>wastes to some sort of holding area wherein micro-organisms break down
>the waste.  The discussion of "Glop" seems to further indicate that this
>waste is then fed into a reprocessor, and turned back into food that
>humans can consume.

There are some things that I don't want to know.  This makes me think of a scene in 
one of Larry Niven's books, probably Ringworld, in which the puppeteers have set up the 
interior of one of their starships for human use.  They've very efficiently put the 
toilet and galley side-by-side, so that no long hoses are needed to connect the waste 
treatment and reclamation unit from the food production unit.  The humans, as I recall, 
are not pleased, but just shrug it off with a comment like, well, that is efficient.

- --Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:45:04 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Re: Laundry in the Far Future

>From: "Peter  H. Brenton" <pete@cummings.uchicago.edu>

>Freshers are multifunction devices good for cleaning people, clothes,
>dishes, etc. using sonic energy.

Your universe is a really alien place.  I don't think that we're going to give 
up washing in water.  It's part of the aesthetics that make space travel bearable.  
There's also no shortage of water -- starships are, well, flush with water because of 
their fuel requirements.  

>When something or someone is placed into the fresher chamber and the door
>is closed, the contents are 'vibrated' at certain precise frequencies such
>that the particles of dirt and dried skin (which makes up most of what we
>wash away in the shower) are literally 'shaken loose' and fall to the
>floor (which is gridwork).

My comments to the foregoing to the contrary nothwithstanding, if you're going to 
persist in this folly, you should put a negative ion generator under the gridwork to 
help get all of the particles to clump together and end up in the same place.  Then you 
can vacuum them out into space.  

[nice adventure hooks and stuff deleted]

>Toilets, I believe, are basically unchanged from airplane chemical
>toilets.  Although the chemicals are, undoubtedly, more efficient.  I
>take pumping the storage tanks to be part of the biweekly maintanence
>activity done at starports. (of course, you could always just dump it in
>orbit, or the local state park equivalent.  Might get you in trouble
>though).

You can dump right into jumpspace, I would think.  

>Sonic showers are considered not the same as real water showers, and TAS
>clubs and starports will often rent shower time to spacers passing
>through.  The savings in space and weight of the water on board is usually
>considered worth it.

No, starships have lots of water available from the fuel (liquid hydrogen, which should 
be convertible to water; just add oxygen and do it in a safe place).  The used water is 
then purified and returned to the fuel tanks.

- --Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 13:28:14 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: NAVAL ACADEMY and MARINES

>From: 34zbtxq@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu (Susan M. Shock)

>Also, unlike previous versions of Traveller, Marines no longer get Gunnery
>as one of their skills, thus reducing their usefulness aboard Naval vessels.
>(In the "old" days, for example, marines served as gunners aboard naval
>vessels).

Bear in mind that the "old" days are actually 1100 years in the future.  At that time, 
Marines routinely received gunnery training, just in case they had to help the naval 
gunners.  This custom has its roots in Arbellatra's naval reforms following the Civil 
War (which ended about -- what -- 600?  I do need books in the office).

The Navy, as you recall, was the Bad Guy in the Civil War, as various admirals fought 
for the Iridium Throne.  The Marines were mostly just along for the ride (or were so 
perceived), and had no choice but to follow orders from their immediate naval superiors. 

After the war, Arbellatra separated the Marines even farther from the Navy, making them 
more directly responsible to central Imperial authority.  This process was stopped 
before Marines became "political officers" as seen in the Soviet Union, but the Marines 
were something of a check on the Navy.  

Immediately after the Civil War, all naval ships' guns were placed under the control of 
the "loyal" Marines.  The Marines were ideally suited to the task, being already present 
on ships, heavily armed with anti-personnel weapons and superior armor, and part of a 
different command structure.  Over time, of course, fear of a naval coup diminished, and 
the Navy got control of its guns again.  Marines still went to gunnery school "just in 
case", however.  By the CT era, the "just in case" is "just in case the gunnery crew all 
get killed in action."  

In Year 0, naval control of the guns wasn't a concern, so the Marines don't get gunnery 
training.

- --Glenn 


I have decided to make an 'official' change in this regard, and am altering
#3 under Service Skills on the Marine character generation charts. This was
originally Gun Combat, and still leaves Marine characters with 2 other Gun
Combat entries on their charts. (Most of the "good skills" seem to occur twice).
        This was put out there for your consideration and use. Enjoy!

The above c. 1996 Far Future Enterprises inc.

                                        Allen Shock

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:36:08 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Laundry in the Far Future

>From: granthh@anubis.network.com (Harley Grantham)

>Some people have mentioned the lack of toilets and showers on some of
>the deck plans, although the DGP plans do have them and call them
>freshers.

I thought that my players would by now have thrown everything at me, but I've never 
thought about this in nearly 20 years of Travelling.  

Maybe it's in the fresher?  Most apartments in Finland (and maybe the rest of Europe; I 
only know about Finnish apartments) have a very small washing machine that fits in the 
bathtub (actually above the bathtub; it has things that rest on the sides of the 
bathtub) ("things" -- now that's a good, precise, technical term).  A hose connects the 
faucet to the washing machine, and the machine of course runs on household current.  It 
drains directly into the bathtub.  It washes a small load of laundry -- like one pair of 
pants, a couple of shirts, several sets of socks and underwear.  When not in use, the 
washing machine is usually stored in the same closet as the towels.  

Until we get a solution that I like better, I'm retrofitting all of my ships with the 
Asuntopesukone (apartmentwashmachine), made by Ling Standard Products (Maytag Division), 
Naasirika, and many other companies.  

- --Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 17:05:26 -0500
From: "Chris Cox" <chriscox@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #791

Hans Rancke wrote:
> It looks like you've lost track of the previous thread. My original
point
> was that the worlds of Corridor Sector had a big slice of their
naval budget
> freed in early 1117 when the whole Corridor Fleet went corewards.
Suddenly
> they are not supporting those ships any more.

Actually I would suspect that the Corridor Sector would still be
supporting the fleet even thought it was move out of sector.  IMHO,
the taxes collected to support the fleet would just be sent along
behind it and would not be available for Corridor to build a new
fleet with.

Chris Cox
(chriscox@ix.netcom.com)
The Draconis Cluster Traveller pages
(http://users.aol.com/yanbeck/trav.htm)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 96 15:18:08 -0500
From: eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)
Subject: Starports (long)

On 12/25/96 at 11:51 PM,  "Phillip McGregor" <aspqrz@curie.dialix.com.au>
said:

> Some of the comments against my proposition that the presence of an A or
> B Starport on a world effectively negates the worlds TL and replaces it
> with Average Imperial (TL12 for Milieu 0, for example). . .

This debate grew out of the "Annual Starship Maintenance thread", if I'm
not mistaken, so let me tell you how *I* run things in my games.

1.  Starships and their components are field repairable.  Just about
anything that breaks, a competent Engineer can repair, patch, or work
around without a Starport's facilities.  Because the Starship's components
are *designed* for field repairability, they are larger, heavier, more
rugged, and lower tech than you might expect.  You don't pull a bad part
and chunk it, you FIX IT!  (Think about what that means to electronics for
example.  That's why the damn computers are so huge.  ;-)

2.  Although a Starport isn't required for repairs it makes for easier,
faster, more sure repairs.  They *are* required if you want to do a
complete overhaul of a ship or if YOU DON'T HAVE A COMPETENT ENGINEER
ABOARD.  They also give you access to replacement components when you can't
fix the darn thing anymore...and when you have the credits to pay for them. 
Rare components, and they can be rare due to tech level, non-standard
design, the port's level, or the GM's decision (my favorite!), cost more.

3.  Starport ratings are a *guide* to what the player can *expect* to find
in that system...they aren't sure things.  (Technology and Government
ratings are also guides, don't let the players be *too* sure of them.)

What the ratings mean is that the last time the system was surveyed there
was:

    A - A sufficient technological base available so that an
        Engineer (or someone he hires locally) could repair
        anything, including the jump drive, and perform a complete
        ship overhaul, if necessary.  There *probably* is a
        starship-building facility.  There *probably* are components
        to replace those that you have fixed and patched and babied
        for months.  Refined fuel should be available.
         
    B - A sufficient technological base available so that an
        Engineer could repair anything, including *maybe* the jump
        drive, and could hire someone to fix *most* things.  A
        complete ship overhaul will take more time, cost more, and
        demand more direct effort from the Engineer herself.  There
        *probably* is a spaceship-building facility.  There *might*
        be components available to replace those you've been fixing,
        patching, and cursing for months.  Refined fuel is most
        likely available.
        
    C - A sufficient technological base available so that an
        Engineer can repair, or contract for the repair of, major
        structural damage to a ship.  There is probably no
        spaceship-building facility, but *perhaps* there are
        drydocks and a few other repair facilities available.  The
        Engineer can repair most other components, but will receive
        little assistance from the local facilities or technicians.
        It is unlikely that components to replace unrepairable or
        heavily patched parts will be available, so you'll just have
        to keep working around the problems as best you can.
        Refined fuel is possible, but unlikely.  Unrefined fuel
        should be available.
        
    D,F,G - A sufficient technological base available so that an
            Engineer can repair minor structural damage to the ship.
            There is no spaceship-building facility, and very few
            (if any) local facilities. No trained personnel will be
            available to assist the Engineer.  Rarely will new
            components be available.  Refined fuel will not be
            available.  Unrefined fuel *probably* will be available.
        
    E,X,H,Y - No technological base is assumed.  The Engineer is
              pretty much on his on.  No new components or fuel can
              be assumed to be available.
        
4.  There are exceptions to *everything*, and nothing is sure. There may be
a Class A port listed, but when the players arrive they find that it isn't
available anymore:  destroyed, downgraded, or made off-limits by the local
authorities.  OTOH, that Class C port might have the services of Class B or
A port now.  The GM shouldn't change things on every site, but throwing in
an occasional curve is good for the players.

5.  The area surrounding a Starport will have technology approaching the
Starport IF the local authorities allow for technological exchange.  If
they don't, and many of the government types won't, then don't expect
"Startown" to be "just like Sylea."  As you move away from the port area
the indigenous technologies will dominate, however expect the occasional
'high tech' item here and there on any world frequented by Starships.

6.  The 1000cr/ton is a guideline, not a law.  Buyers and sellers have the
rule of thumb, that all things considered it should cost about 1000cr/ton
to transport goods from system to system.  The *actual* amount will be
whatever the market (ie GM) will bear.

7.  If fact, *most* things are guidelines, not laws. 


Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:51:08 -0700
From: "Edward Swatschek" <edjs@mindlink.net>
Subject: Re: Water on Starships

> Date:          Thu, 26 Dec 1996 15:08:29 -0600 (CST)
> From:          "Peter  H. Brenton" <pete@cummings.uchicago.edu>

> ... is ther any way to combine Oxygen and Hydrogen to make
> water without creating an explosion?  This is a bit of a drawback 
> (though not a big one).

Low-tech, you can burn hydrogen like you would natural gas, or 
high-tech run them through a fuel-cell to extract electricity.



- --
Edward Swatschek - edjs@mindlink.net

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 18:21:05 -0500
From: Steven K Pritchard <spritch@cinternet.net>
Subject: Re:Starliner Sourcebook

I seem to recall an article in one of the old JTAS (#14 or so?) dealing
with the Starport Authority.

spritch@cinternet.net
http://www.cinternet.net/~mpritch/

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 15:25:18 -0800
From: "Glenn M. Goffin, Esq." <sudet@well.com>
Subject: Re: Tech and Starports

>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
>
>In mail, sdollar@goodnet.com writes:
>
>> 2)  Can the low tech world's infrastructure support the item?  (What
>> good would a cellular phone do you in Rwanda?)
>
>Better recheck the real world. Most of Africa, and a lot of Asia is
>*skipping* "phone lines" and going straight to cellular phones with
>satellite links between cities. It's *cheaper* to build that sort of
>infrastructure, than to build the sort we have with hardwired lines all
>over the place!

They did the same in Latvia few years ago.  Curiously, the original plan
called for cellular phone service in the countryside and regular
wire-based service in the major urban areas, which were already largely
wired.  They (I think it was Deutsche Telekom, but I'm not sure) found,
however, that the cost of upgrading the existing wiring in the urban
areas was prohibitively expensive, so they went with cellular there, and
left the old wiring in place.  At the same time, they found that the cost
of upgrading wiring in the rural areas (which had a fair amount of it,
but nothing like Europe or the USA) was cheaper than a new cellular
installation, so they went with wiring there.  Thus the original plan was
completely reversed, to everyone's satisfaction.

>"Low tech" planets that have been in contact with high tech planets for
>a while are apt to be *very* strange by our standards. Picture the Wild
>West with cell phones or satellite phones available. Or picture the
>Middle Ages or earlier with commanders of armies (at least) being able
>to communicate *real time* with both each other and with their
>king/emperor/whatever.

This isn't too far removed from the Russian Far East or some of the newly independent 
states like Kazakhstan today.

>Picture the players being properly impressed with how well he can
>predict the weather, and then as they are parting at the port asking
>him about it, and being told "Oh, I just call up the weather forecast
>from the port...." :-)

ROTFL.

- --Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:09:09 -0500
From: GoldRushG@aol.com
Subject: Old AOL Mail

<< I wonder if there is any way to get access to old email... does AOL backup
them somewhere? >>

  Yes. Click on "Mail" on the command bar, and then click "Read Mail You've
Sent."

  Mark

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:09:23 -0500
From: GoldRushG@aol.com
Subject: Art & misanthropic geeks

<< This book is total garbage.  96 pages, and not a single color plate!
It's almost completely text!  >>

  I can assure you, as a publisher, that interior color plates would add to
the cost of the product. They are expensive, not only for the printing but to
pay for the art itself. It makes sense to have them in a core product that
will continue to sell over time, but less so for a supplement. While they
look pretty, there are cost-to-profit ratios to consider. Personally, I would
rather they spend the money on more supplements with B&W art.

<< Like I have time to read!  I didn't get into role-playing to spend my day
reading like some misanthropic geek. Every book should be patterned after the
first half of _Starships_: lots of pictures, little text. >>

  No comment.  ;)

   Mark @ GRG

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:09:19 -0500
From: GoldRushG@aol.com
Subject: T4 Adventures

<< One thing I thik IG needs to do is get publishing...ADVENTURES!  A lot of
new GMs do not want to have to go through the time of creating their own
adventures.  Plus, published adventures add a lot of canon (dare i use that
word <g>) material to the game. >>

  Speaking only for Gold Rush Games, we are planning to release at least
three adventure anthology books next year: The Kargol Federation, Derelict!,
and The Pheonix Foundation. Without making any promises, we are hoping to
have the first out by next summer. (We wouldn't want to rush it, would we?)

<< Joe, could you get a read from IG on whether or not _they_ will produce
adventure supplements or leave it to third parties such as CORE, DGP, Gold
Rush Games, etc.>>

  I cannot and would not speak for IG, but we will be concentrating on
publishing adventures for T4 (as opposed to sourcebooks), per Marc Miller's
request. For that matter, Mr. Miller will be reviewing all of our products
prior to authorizing their release.

  I would like to extend an invitation to all Traveller fans and
afficionados, also, to submit proposals for either single adventures
(8,000-10,000 words) or whole anthologies (books of 5-6 single adventures,
linked/related or not). We would certianly like to publish a lot of
adventures for T4. We enjoy the game, and want to provide a means for more
folks to enjoy it as well.

  Mark Arsenault
  Gold Rush Games

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 00:07:35 +0000
From: D Jones <dojones@whitestar.u-net.com>
Subject: Psionic Knights?

I'm currently ref'ing the a campaign which had its roots in
William Connors' Psionic Knights scenario, (Travellers' Digest #14-#17).
I wonder if any of you have done this (or are doing) because I would
like to exchange some ideas.

Any comments to dojones@whitestar.u-net.com or to the mailing list if 
you consider it a broad enough topic to be included...

Thanks for the last 2 weeks of frenzied reading, & season's greetings to all.

Del Jones
Lancashire UK

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 00:07:33 +0000
From: D Jones <dojones@whitestar.u-net.com>
Subject: Re: Laundry in the Far Future

At 12:36 26/12/96 -0800, you wrote:
>>From: granthh@anubis.network.com (Harley Grantham)
>
>>Some people have mentioned the lack of toilets and showers on some of
>>the deck plans, although the DGP plans do have them and call them
>>freshers.
>
>I thought that my players would by now have thrown everything at me, but
I've never 
>thought about this in nearly 20 years of Travelling.  
>

>Until we get a solution that I like better, I'm retrofitting all of my
ships with the 
>Asuntopesukone (apartmentwashmachine), made by Ling Standard Products
(Maytag Division), 
>Naasirika, and many other companies.  
>
>--Glenn
>
>
The players in my game, 4 detatched duty scouts, would probably laugh at the
idea.
Their bi-weekly grunge contests are *legendary* ( in my group anyway !)

They like the TAS (or other establishments) to really earn the cost of board
& lodgings..

Does anybody else have this problem with scouts?
(It is pretty much akin to some of the antics done by members of my old unit
on maneuvers! Is this why the used to call us the Pongos ?)

Del Jones
Lancashire, UK

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:04:42 +0000
From: "Kenneth Bearden" <dreamer@brokersys.com>
Subject: Re: Starliner Sourcebook?

On 26 Dec 96 at 10:43, GoldRushG@aol.com wrote:

>   This is an idea I had for a Traveller sourcebook to be published by GRG.
> I'm interested in your opinions.
> 
> STARLINERS (Working Title)


I like this idea.  It reminds me of a similiar project done by Judges 
Guild for CT.  

If the project was done well and looked good, I'd buy it.

Kenneth.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 20:00:10 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph E. Walsh" <ransom@connect.iconnect.net>
Subject: Re: Art & misanthropic geeks

On Thu, 26 Dec 1996 GoldRushG@aol.com wrote:

>   I can assure you, as a publisher, that interior color plates would add to
> the cost of the product. They are expensive, not only for the printing but to
> pay for the art itself. It makes sense to have them in a core product that
> will continue to sell over time, but less so for a supplement. While they
> look pretty, there are cost-to-profit ratios to consider. Personally, I would
> rather they spend the money on more supplements with B&W art.

[cough]  Uh, you did realize that post of mine which you are responding 
to was a joke, right?  The by line was "Lam Poon." :)  I didn't expect a 
serious response.


- -Joe
______________________________________________________________________________
Joseph E. Walsh      |  Atari 8-Bit User and Programmer Since 1982
ransom@iconnect.net  |  Classic Traveller Referee Since 1983
Stuck in the '80s    |  Microsoft-Free and Loving It! :)
       .....Official Reporter of Imperium Games Product Info.....

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:01:15 -0800
From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Starliner Sourcebook?

>  The book could be used in any Era, but would be written to compliment IG's
>line of books. We could also throw in more detail about the Traveller's Aid
>Society, including members-only lounges at starports, etc.

I like it, a lot.  One recommendation though, deckplans, Real Deckplans,
GOOD DECKPLANS.  Also Deckplans for the lounges would be nice.  Also it
would be nice if it were well written.  As for art, all I care about is
simple art that complements the (you guessed it) DECKPLANS.

Seriously I think it would be great, and actually mean what I say in the
previous paragraph.

				Zane

| Zane H. Healy                    | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh@ix.netcom.com (primary)  | Linux Enthusiast          |
| healyzh@holonet.net (alternate)  | Mac Programmer            |
+----------------------------------+---------------------------+
| For Empire of the Petal Throne, and Traveller Role Playing   |
| see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/                      |

-------                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                 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